Showing posts with label Debates. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Debates. Show all posts

Saturday, September 29, 2007

Republicans & Democrats Collaborate to Triangulate

'Triangulate' the American people right out of government.

Republican Senators Call For End to Iraq War, But Only After Bush Leaves Office

The International Herald Tribune reports:
A small group of Republicans facing election fights next year have rallied around war legislation they think could unite the party: Call for an end to U.S. combat in Iraq, but wait until President George W. Bush is almost out of office.

The majority Democrats deemed the proposal a nonstarter and underscored on Friday the difficulty Congress has in striking a bipartisan compromise about the war. What attracts Democrats has repelled Republicans and vice versa, making it impossible so far to find middle ground.
"I don't support it at all," said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid. "It doesn't do anything."

The proposal, by Republican Sen. George Voinovich, would require that Bush change the mission of U.S. troops from combat to primarily support roles, such as training Iraqi security forces and protecting U.S. infrastructure in Iraq. His legislation would set a goal of completing such a mission transition within 15 months.

If enacted immediately, that timeline would not kick in until Bush's last couple of weeks in office.
Now exactly who is it that's playing politics?
"That's very courageous," Reid quipped when a reporter asked him Friday about the proposal.

Co-sponsors of the bill include Sen. Lamar Alexander, Elizabeth Dole and Norm Coleman, all Republicans. Of the sponsors, only Voinovich is not up for re-election in 2008.

In response to Reid's rejection, a Voinovich spokesman said the senator "will continue to work for a bipartisan, nonpolitical compromise so our nation finally speaks with one voice."

Likewise, Alexander said the country is ready for consensus on the war.

"It is inexcusable for the Senate to keep lecturing Baghdad about being in a political stalemate when we continue to be stuck in our own political stalemate on Iraq," he said in an e-mailed statement Friday.

The Senate is in the midst of wrapping up debate on a $672 billion (€474 billion) defense policy bill that would authorize more than a one-half trillion dollars (€350 billion) in annual defense spending and $150 billion (€106 billion) for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, including $23 billion (€16 billion) added for Mine Resistant Ambush Protected vehicles.
Every budget request that Bush has sent to Congress has been granted...and then some.

Democrats are afraid that if they refuse to give Bush the money to fund the war, they will be blamed when the troops lose their lives and limbs because they didn't have MRAPs (Mine Resistant Ambush Protected vehicles). But the troops not having MRAPs isn't the fault of Democrats or Congress. Congress has paid for them in past budgets, but they haven't gotten to Iraq. Over four years into this war and the few that have gotten to Iraq go to the private contractors and not the troops. Consider that during WWII, our newly industrialized labor force, where women were pressed into service to reproduce the ships and planes that the Japanese destroyed in Pearl Harbor, completed one B24 bomber every 63 minutes. As a matter of fact, within one decade (of December 7, 1941), Americans rebuilt the Navy's arsenal, won the war in the European and Pacific theaters, and went on to rebuild all of Europe and a good part of Japan and the Phillipines.
The bill, on track to be passed on Monday, also would make it easier for Iraqi refugees to apply for U.S. visas. An amendment by Democratic Sen. Edward Kennedy, adopted on Thursday, would provide 5,000 special immigrant visas each year for five years; the new visas would be given to Iraqis who fear retribution because they worked for the U.S. government in Iraq.

Senate Democrats tried to attach legislation ordering an end to combat but repeatedly failed to muster the 60 votes needed to overcome parliamentary hurdles.

Sen. Carl Levin, the Democratic chairman of the Armed Services Committee, said he worked closely with Voinovich until late Thursday in the hopes of striking a compromise. Levin wants to set the goal in nine months, but acknowledges he lacks the votes to pass it.

After Voinovich suggested extending the goal to 15 months, Democratic support dissipated, said Levin.

"To try to put this off until after the election, rather than a reasonable period of completion, I believe would be to unnecessarily introduce a political element to what is a bipartisan effort," he said.

Voinovich, Alexander and Coleman have been outspoken critics of Bush's war strategy, citing voter frustration with what they say seems an open-ended military commitment in Iraq. Coleman in particular has become a popular political target by anti-war groups hoping to replace him with a Democratic candidate willing to demand troop withdrawals.

But each of the Republican senators has rejected Democratic legislation that includes a timetable for troop withdrawals, contending they do not want to tie the hands of military generals and a wartime president.
Republicans aren't willing to tie their hands in 9 months, but they are willing to do it in 15-months. This is yet one more verification that this war is a fraud, a scam, and these politicians are as guilty of war crimes as Bush and Cheney are.
While the defense policy bill approves war spending for next year, it does not guarantee it; Bush will have to wait for Congress to pass a separate appropriations bill that transfers money to the military's coffers.

Democratic leaders say the recent passage of a stopgap spending bill that funds the Pentagon at 2007 levels gives the military enough money to keep the war going for a few more months. A spending bill to pay for combat through next September might not be passed until early next year, officials said.
This revelation alone should end the careers of the co-sponsors, Senators Voinovich, Dole, Coleman and Alexander.

This legislation exposes problems for both sides of the aisle. Democrats don't come off looking any better, and brings to mind that old joke alleged to have happened to George Bernard Shaw and a woman he'd encountered at a dinner party.
"Madam," he said, "would you sleep with me for one million pounds?"

The woman replied, "I most certainly would!"

"Would you sleep with me for one pound?" Shaw asked.

"What sort of woman do you take me for?" she answered angrily.

"We've already established that," said Shaw. "Now we're just dickering over the price."
Republicans are willing to let American soldiers die for the sake of their individual careers, Republican party unity and overall loyalty to George W. Bush. Both Republicans and Democrats demonstrate with this legislation that they'd be willing to lie to their constituents and kick the can down the road (again) in order to get reelected. And since this past week's Democratic debate at Dartmouth, the top leading contenders for the Democratic nomination (Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, John Edwards) have all stated that should one of them become president, the U.S. is in Iraq for (Cheney's) 'long war' - at least through 2013, which was as far down the road as the debate's moderater (Tim Russert) kicked that particular question. The only candidates who pledged to bring the troops out were Dennis Kucinich (within 3 months of his inauguration), Bill Richardson (within one year of his inauguration), Mike Gravel (explains how to do it now, with a Democratically controlled Congress committed to ending the war despite not having 60 votes) and Chris Dodd (one to two brigades a month).

I was about to skip over Joe Biden, as he's neither in the top tier of Democratic candidates nor is he pledging to bring the troops out of Iraq (or ending the war) by 2013, but that isn't how things are done here at The Constant American: "When citizens are fully informed, they share liberals' opinions and voting records."

The Democratic presidential candidates at Wednesday's debate at Dartmouth on getting the troops out of Iraq and ending the war:




Part A





Part B


Friday, September 28, 2007

So Much For a Democratic President Getting Us Out of Iraq

The Democratic presidential candidates met to debate. Again. Only this time, the message was clear: "Bush got us into this mess and we Democrats (in Congress or the White House) won't be getting us out":





Part A





Part B





Part C





Part D






Part E





Part F





Part G





Part H





Part I





Part J





Part K





Part L





Part M





Part N





Part O





Part P

Tuesday, March 13, 2007

Turnabout

Air America Offers To Host One Of The Republican Party's Debates



I wonder what Bill O' will have to say about that?

Mark Green, the new president of Air America, writes:

After Nevada Democrats dropped Fox as a host of its Democratic presidential debate -- and after Fox denounced the move as anti-free speech and "Stalinist" -- I thought...damn right! How dare the progressive party in America not allow the conservative Fox to air its presidential debate. So I today contacted key Republican party chairs in the four early primary and caucus states to ask that Air America host their Republican presidential debates.

A blow for speech and against Stalin in one swoop:
Dear Republican Chairman Ray Hoffmann of Iowa, Republican Chairman Paul Willis of Nevada, Republican Chairman Katon Dawson of South Carolina and Republican Chairman Fergus Cullen of New Hampshire,

As the new president of Air America, I'd like to offer to host or co-host one of your upcoming presidential debates.

Why us? First, this would allow your debate to reach many voters. Combining our 2 million radio audience, along with our satellite, internet and web audiences, means that some 2.5 million Americans would hear or read about the debate..

Second, it would allow Republicans to differentiate themselves from Democrats - embracing a debate hosted by a progressive media outlet after Nevada Democrats canceled a debate scheduled to be hosted by the conservative Fox Cable News Channel. The MoveOn organization spurred 265,000 people to complain about the original plan, calling Fox a "mouthpiece for the Republican Party." In reply, Fox's Mort Kondracke called the Nevada Democratic Party's rejection of Fox a "Stalinist" violation of "free speech and free debate." So should you accept Air America's offer, Republicans would both embrace free debate and stick it to Stalin at the same time.

Third, our offer permits you to include any other national media company as a co-host -- like Fox. For example, a panel with Fox representing the conservative viewpoint and Air America the progressive viewpoint would make for a very "fair and balanced" debate -- not to mention that Fox's viewers per evening are coincidentally comparable to our 2.5 million listeners, meaning that several million unique people would hear your debate (assuming next to no overlap between our two disparate audiences).

We would be honored not only to co-host such an event; but also to broadcast it live without commercial interruption on the day that you choose.

I look forward to your response and to working with you on this important event.


Yours,

Mark Green
President, Air America Radio

Will the GOP accept the offer?